Eric Q wrote:I think your swap would be intriguing. I disagree somewhat with the fact that the weight doesn't make a difference. It may only be only 100 lbs or so, but it is all over the front wheels and I believe you will feel in in the handling (you may have to adjust the front springs, it may sit too high).
IMHO, it is similar to the difference between a 528e and 533i...the 528e does feel more tossable.
Good luck with getting it to pass the emissions testing...
it already happene. Car sits way higher in the front now. Big difference in random stuff in the engine bay. Lighter radiator, plastic vs metal water reservoir etc. No a\c and lighter exhaust. II'm going with coilovers so it will be fine. No smog for my year.
The part you need to make the mod easier is the front sub frame from an E12 520/6.... O yeah I have one and the car is going to be parted out soon. However I do agree with everyone that the M20 isn't the right engine to use in the E12. the 3.5L M30s weight difference is more than made up for with there power. the M20 will be sluggish off the line.
Sam
merlin_m3_racing (at) yahoo.com
78 530i 3.5L
80 520/6
71 2002
76 2002 parts
83 635csi Euro
87 325i
88 Toyota 4-Runner
88 Toyota 4-Runner V6
88 Toyota pickup
2017 Toyota Tacoma
1997 F350
2007 Honda Accord
2008 Honda Civic
Merlin wrote:The part you need to make the mod easier is the front sub frame from an E12 520/6.... O yeah I have one and the car is going to be parted out soon. However I do agree with everyone that the M20 isn't the right engine to use in the E12. the 3.5L M30s weight difference is more than made up for with there power. the M20 will be sluggish off the line.
Sam
merlin_m3_racing (at) yahoo.com
i totally get that the m20 is not the best approach to this car. I have an e30 and i have it for drift only. I had the m20 and it was fun, but its gone and a mustang 5.0 ots about to take its place.... torque, torque, torque... now im not just throwing an m20 and call it a day.. im working on a diet to get my e12 skinnier and i mentioned it going to be turbo! Why doesnt anybody says anything about that? Im goimg with fully built head, completely upgraded fuelrail/ fuel system, 255lph fuel pump, external boost sensitive fuel pressure regulator. Arp headbolts, custom made ecu chip and 10 psi. (To begin with) of boost on a 800+ capable comp turbo! Is that still too gay for an e12?????? Lol
There are a few problems with the M20 that your stuck with. the biggest one is trying to keep that timing belt in place on an engine with heavy mods. the other big issue with the M20 is going to be where the power band is. no matter how much of a diet you put an e12 on she will always be a big heavy pig. that's also why you survive a lot of hard crashes in them. Take my E30 race car (with an M20), I generate more then enough power with my engine to drift it. its not so much what I did to the engine but that the car is all steel (full custom cage) and it weights under 2,000lbs (+me).
The M30 engine does not have the reliability issues that the M20s do. There was even a version with a factory turbo (745i) that you can bolt in and modify. other guys here have taken bits of these engine such as the sodium filled valves and made there own turbo charger setups. There has even been an LS1 bolted into an e12. While I prefer mine with my M30 3.5L big valve engine at the end of the day you need to make the car yours. the world of BMW enthusiasts or wankers hasn't picked up on how great our cars are so they leave us alone to do our own thing. My big suggestion is to make sure you do the car so that it can be put back later if you change your mind. To me your throwing good money away on an M20 with low torque on a heavy car. however its your project and you should enjoy it an make it yours. We are just caution you that at the end of the day its the wrong engine and you would be better served with the M30 in the long run.
Sam
78 530i 3.5L
80 520/6
71 2002
76 2002 parts
83 635csi Euro
87 325i
88 Toyota 4-Runner
88 Toyota 4-Runner V6
88 Toyota pickup
2017 Toyota Tacoma
1997 F350
2007 Honda Accord
2008 Honda Civic
Merlin wrote:There are a few problems with the M20 that your stuck with. the biggest one is trying to keep that timing belt in place on an engine with heavy mods. the other big issue with the M20 is going to be where the power band is. no matter how much of a diet you put an e12 on she will always be a big heavy pig. that's also why you survive a lot of hard crashes in them. Take my E30 race car (with an M20), I generate more then enough power with my engine to drift it. its not so much what I did to the engine but that the car is all steel (full custom cage) and it weights under 2,000lbs (+me).
The M30 engine does not have the reliability issues that the M20s do. There was even a version with a factory turbo (745i) that you can bolt in and modify. other guys here have taken bits of these engine such as the sodium filled valves and made there own turbo charger setups. There has even been an LS1 bolted into an e12. While I prefer mine with my M30 3.5L big valve engine at the end of the day you need to make the car yours. the world of BMW enthusiasts or wankers hasn't picked up on how great our cars are so they leave us alone to do our own thing. My big suggestion is to make sure you do the car so that it can be put back later if you change your mind. To me your throwing good money away on an M20 with low torque on a heavy car. however its your project and you should enjoy it an make it yours. We are just caution you that at the end of the day its the wrong engine and you would be better served with the M30 in the long run.
Sam
thanks a lot for your imput. You mentioned 2 things that are very true and are an issue i was thinking about before. Torque and powerband (in relation to vehicle weight). I was focusing a lot on taking a lot of weight out to compensate for very little low end torque, i guess the only way to really figure out things is to actually experimenting. Im pretty close to finishing the swap and eventually testing it. Its my daily driver and im planning to have it very low. Ill see how sluggish it ends up being and give you guys some input. Im also working on my coil over setup and collecting part, once i finish collecting ill post all the stuff for others for reference. Thanks again!
2.0 M20 was a standard option on the E12, for daily driving it's ok. I am not sure what all the fuss is about here.
A friend of mine is able do some crazy stuff with a M20B25 in a weight-reduced and lowered E12.
So the 2.7 engine, if the low rev head is ditched, should be good for some fun.
1961 Simson AWO sport (Brasoveanca)
1968 BMW 114 2002
1976 BMW E12 528 (Malèna)
1987 Kawasaki GPz900r
1996 Moto Guzzi V75 PA NT
Falkenberg wrote:2.0 M20 was a standard option on the E12, for daily driving it's ok. I am not sure what all the fuss is about here.
A friend of mine is able do some crazy stuff with a M20B25 in a weight-reduced and lowered E12.
So the 2.7 engine, if the low rev head is ditched, should be good for some fun.
i always wondered about the 520s , so, its like a slower version 5 series lol! We'll see how mine goes. Thanks man
Looks like good progress nice work...I have a 520i in the driveway with a 2.0 six (150hp) that is not an M20 its a timing chain motor. I'm most likely going to swap a 5.0 Ford in that car or an LS engine.
Hanging out in Huntsville
1977 530i 60K
1980 525 Euro
1989 E30 Cab
1992 E30 Cab
1976 R75/6
1974 2002
Alfas
