Need Help: lots of vibration with driveshaft

[munkeeboi83]

Diagnosis:
About two weeks or so, I started having a lot of vibration right over the rear axles and all along the driveshaft. At times the vibration feels like a slight hum and sometimes the whole car is shaking and vibrating and feels like it'll fall apart at any time. At times towards the right drive axle, I'll get a jack hammer sound or large thumping sound for a few seconds and then it'll go away for a little while.

I checked under the driveshaft and I noticed the guibo was all worn out. There were large chunks of rubber missing in the middle on all 6 wides. I also have the right side CV boot opened up on the right side of the driveshaft. There seems to be a good amount of grease inside, just the clamp and boot is torn but it's not too bad. Also the Final Drive is leaking a bit but I changed the fluid with 80W90 a little while ago (1-2 months).

What do you think I should do?

I have a new guibo that I bought but haven't put in since I wanted to get some advice before I try to put it in. I didn't want to screw anything up.

Driveshaft support? I looked at the U-joint and it seemed okay as well. I looked up and down the driveshaft and everything else seemed okay. Any other things that I should take a look at. I wish I had a digital camera to take some pictures to show you guys. Thanks a lot for your help.

[wkohler]

You need to replace the guibo stat. You'll end up causing further damage to other parts of the driveshaft. Also, replace the axle boots, as you don't want the grease to get contaminated (sounds weird, yes) with bits of debris.

Also check to make sure the weights are present on the driveshaft.

[John in Simi Valley]

munkeeboi83 (Monkey Boy '83?)
From your initial description, it's a drive line problem.
Question1: is the vibration only during initial acceleration? High-torque situations are characteristic of drive shaft.
Question2: Does it occur at high speed? High speed is usually tires out of balance. Perhaps you lost a wheel weight?
Your guibo being all torn up is solid confirmation of bad drive line.
Remember to install the bolts before cutting the outer band.

The other thing might be the center support, but you say it's okay.
Also, the drive shaft U-joints could be going bad. Only way to confirm is to remove the shaft, you'll be mostly there replacing the guibo anyway, so extract the whole thing. Check the play of the joints. Check for any slight "clicking" as you rock it up-down & side-to-side.

Good Luck!

[munkeeboi83]

munkeeboi83 (Monkey Boy '83?)
yup, I was born in 1983, it's an old screen name that I've used.
From your initial description, it's a drive line problem.
Question1: is the vibration only during initial acceleration? High-torque situations are characteristic of drive shaft.
There is vibration or humming all along the driveshaft when ever the car is in gear. It does get bad/worse during hard acceleration or I push the car hard when shifting. I guess these would be high torque situations. Sometimes it happens when I'm just cruising along and once in a while I'll get a jack hammer sound for a few seconds and then it'll go away. I've been taking it very easy on the car when driving to try to prevent this from occurring.

Question2: Does it occur at high speed? High speed is usually tires out of balance. Perhaps you lost a wheel weight?
Your guibo being all torn up is solid confirmation of bad drive line.
Remember to install the bolts before cutting the outer band.
There is definitely more vibration and the humming is louder at high speed. I don't think it's from the wheels since I have fresh tires (1-2 months old) and they've been balanced as well. I haven't had an alignment done though. I have E39 (older 5-series) stock BBS wheels on my car and I've heard from Pierre sometimes there are problems with wheel wobble since they're a little weird. I haven't had any problems so far though. I do have the stock 14" turbines that I could throw on to just test things out.

The other thing might be the center support, but you say it's okay.
Also, the drive shaft U-joints could be going bad. Only way to confirm is to remove the shaft, you'll be mostly there replacing the guibo anyway, so extract the whole thing. Check the play of the joints. Check for any slight "clicking" as you rock it up-down & side-to-side.

I'm going to definitely check the joints. I don't remembering seeing a center support, so I'm going to have to do some more research and make some more checks. I noticed a Drivelines Unlimited sticker on the driveshaft, so I'm probably going to give them a call and see if there is a warranty or anything.

They were formerly located in Lake Forest, CA. Have any of the OC guys been to them before?

Drivelines Unlimited
6 McLaren St. Suite M
Irvine, CA 92618-2817
800-963-7483

[munkeeboi83]

More info to better explain the "jammer hammer sound" I get sometimes. They call it a "clicking sound."

http://www.rogueengineering.com/Merchan ... Code=GUIBO

[Karl in KS]

Like kohler said, replace the guibo. When it wears out it will send vibration all up and down the drive line. First time I had one go bad, I thought the whole drive shaft was coming out of the car (actually, that is what's happening). It was a really bad shaking/hammering and could easily explain everything you feel. That vibration in my car got real bad real fast, not gradual wear out at all.

Likewise, repairing the U-joint boot needs to be done right away to keep the grease in and the sand and water out.

[Dave Rutkowski]

e39 wheels have a larger hub bore and don't center properly on an e12 without hub-centering rings. Put the stock wheels back on and see if that, plus the guibo, doesn't fix it.

[munkeeboi83]

e39 wheels have a larger hub bore and don't center properly on an e12 without hub-centering rings. Put the stock wheels back on and see if that, plus the guibo, doesn't fix it.

I've also heard the exact thing that you said about E39 wheels from Pierre.

Update:
I had some spare time today and with the help of my Dad, I got the guibo off and also the front part of the drive shaft off. The guibo was very badly cracked and was barely hanging on. Unfortunately, I didn't have bearing puller, so my Dad will be taking it to work tomorrow to replace the main bearing. The rubber part of the main bearing was warped and elongated into a oval shape.

Good news. I found my camera and will be posting up pictures and doing a mini tutorial once I finish putting everything back together.

[munkeeboi83]

I finally put in the new guibo (flexible disc coupling) and center bearing with the help of my Dad yesterday and it wasn't too difficult to put everything back together.

Procedure to replace the guibo and center bearing.

Tools needed:
Guibo: 19mm bolts and nuts
Center bearing: 13 mm bolts and nuts
Heat shield covering: 10mm nuts, one 11mm bolt on the passenger side
Bearing puller to remove center bearing off of the drive shaft.
Red Loc-Tite
Jack Stand and Floor Jack
Creeper to make crawling underneath your car a little bit easier

1. Jack up the car and use jack stands for safety purposes and also ensure plenty of room to crawl under and remove the driveshaft.
2. start removing bolts on guibo (19mm). I used an open end 19mm on the nut and socket with 19mm head on the bolt head. I locked up the open end wrench against the body of the vehicle and then use then pulled hard on the socket to torque it free (opposite direction from pulling on the socket). Having a buddy to help you out definitely helps here.
3. I did this for a few of the bolts and then released the parking break and made sure the car was in neutral and rotated the driveshaft until I removed all 6 bolts and all the bits and pieces of the guibo that was badly deteriorated.
4. Remove the heat shield to get to the main/center bearing. All the nuts are 10mm except one which is screwed in which was 11mm. I'm not sure what happened here. Maybe it's only my car. Becareful to place all the nuts and washers in a plastic container so you don't lose them. It will take some bending and flexing to get the heat shield off.
5. There are two 13mm nuts holding the center and main bearing off. Remove these.
6. You will then have to bend the driveshaft at the U-joint to remove the front half of the drive shaft. You will prob want to part the cap screwing in the front half of the driveshaft in after the U-joint or count the number of threads like I did (8 threads).
7. Unscrew the cap. It's a large hex shape and since I didn't have a very large open end wrench. I used a combination of a channel lock and a crescent wrench to get off the cap to allow the splines of the front half of the drive shaft to separate.
8. It will take some bending and flexing to get the drive shaft off.
9. Remove the the center bearing with a bearing puller.
10. Clean up and regrease the spline.
11. To re-install the center bearing and drive shaft as well as flexible disc coupling, you would do the reverse of what I have listed. Things to consider when re-install use Red Loc-Tite on the bolts fo the guibo. When reinstalling the center bearing. I used a ruler and measured 0.25 inches from the front opening of the little channel where the bolt comes down and where the center bearing mates up. I think the BMW manual says to measure 0.20 inches from the top. I made sure both sides were exactly the same and tightened everything up. Also tighten up the cap screwing and tightening up the driveshaft. Make sure that the circle shape of the bearing faces inwards towards the car body and the driveshaft should be nice and straight. If your driveshaft is bent towards you, you prob have the bearing on wrong. Replace the heat shield and the guibo with the bolts and you should be ready to go.

I hope my short write up helps any of you guys that might be replacing your guibo in the near future.

Notes:
I test the drove the car right after I put everything together and drove it on surface streets and also on the freeway. No more flexible or having the driveshaft bounce up and down. There's also no more humming while driving or unnecessary vibration. The ride is also a lot more quieter now. The car also seems to shift a lot more smoother as well. The new guibo and flexible disc coupling definitely made a big difference. There are a few little hums but I think it might be due to the exhaust or something. I guess I'll have to inspect that later on when the rains clear. Thanks a lot for everyone's help.

Pictures:
Worn out guibo


Old guibo or what's left of it Vs. Brand New Guibo


After Guibo was pulled out. Front part of driveshaft with bolts taken out.


Where Center Bearing Mates up to driveshaft. You need to adjust the copper cold threaded post 0.25" inorder to pre-load the driveshaft when you put it back together.


Remove drive shaft with center bearing still attached and cap where you screw it on to holding driveshaft together. You will need a large open end, crescent wrench or channel lock to get it off. Remember to mark this and count the threads.


Driveshaft removed. The rubber surround is elongated like an oval prob due to the bad guibo, giving knock and machine gun sounds when I was driving it before.


warped Center Bearing

[wkohler]

HOLY CRAP!

The steel in the yoke shouldn't have deformed like that. That looks like the "uroparts" center support bearing.

[munkeeboi83]

HOLY CRAP!

The steel in the yoke shouldn't have deformed like that. That looks like the "uroparts" center support bearing.

yea, it was elongated in an oval shape. It must have been front the guibo being all worn out causing the driveshaft to bounce all over the place.

What's "uroparts"?

[wkohler]

What's "uroparts"?

One of the worst manufacturers of anything.

[larsobg]

The tailpipe is known to introduce a distinct hum or noise if the exhaust pipe stops short of the back of the bumper. For proper sound/exhaust exit, the tailpipe should extend 2-3 inches PAST the back of the bumper. Stopping under the car or bumper will create noise IN the car.

This is particularly true if you are using exhausts that are louder than stock, like the Bosal system.

[munkeeboi83]

The tailpipe is known to introduce a distinct hum or noise if the exhaust pipe stops short of the back of the bumper. For proper sound/exhaust exit, the tailpipe should extend 2-3 inches PAST the back of the bumper. Stopping under the car or bumper will create noise IN the car.

This is particularly true if you are using exhausts that are louder than stock, like the Bosal system.

yea, I think you're absolutely right on the dot with that one. The exhaust on the car right now is quite old and is on my list of things to replace. What kind of exhausts do you recommend and where would I find them? I should prob start a few new thread, but ohhh well. I remember Super Sprint making an exhaust for the E12 if my memory serves me well.

[T.Hanson]

If at all reusable, keep the clamp from the new guibo. I've not seen one. All I know is replacing a clutch or anything requiring removing, installing a still serviceable guibo is a bear. The drat things expand just enough to invite skinning bolt threads, frustration fights with hammers and levers. Last solution was a monster channel locks that worked great to compress the holes into line up.

Six bolts: Look on realoem.com to see how the factory installed them three forward, three back. It makes some sense for clearance and ease of installation. Ease meaning only slightly less difficult, and I'm not sure installing them all one direction would cause a major calamity.

Never to dispute the right way, it happens circumstances and my ignorance have reused the lock nuts, without locktite for ten years, two cars each, guibos, no problems. I don't advocate cheap, sloppy work but every now and then I wonder what expert recommendations are critical, and which are over the top guaranteed super,...parts sellers.